A local newspaper in Georgia, USA, reports that some local residents are buying Iraqi dinars in cash form, in the hope of profiting from a revaluation of the currency.
According to the Moultrie Observer, people are buying boxes of crisp Iraqi dinars that look fresh off the printing press. It goes on to quote a local commodities trader as saying he could possibly think of worse investments than Iraqi money at this time, but would be hard pressed to do so:
"If you want to make a wild investment, I'd buy Russian rubles ... It (the dinar) would be one of the most foolhardy investments you can make."
Meanwhile, CNBC columnist Kelley Holland says the dinar is the subject of a variety of scams, and regulators and watchdogs are sounding alarms:
"If someone has been telling you about the rosy prospects for the dinar, please, please, be careful. It's almost certainly too good a story to be true."
On Thursday, Komo News in Seattle, Washington, ran a news report on the dinar and interviewed one woman who had actually bought what she believes to be Iraqi dinars on the internet. You can find the full video report on the next page ...
Eddy… It might be best to stop using the word RV. What Iraq is planning is a redenomination. It is a pretty common procedure. It’s happened about 80 times in the last 40 or so years… so on average about twice a year some country redenominates. A redenomination is simply a tool to erase the effects of past inflation. Many many countries suffer high inflation and the currency value drops, when they answer that problem by simply more and more currency, with higher and higher denominations, it swells the money supply numbers. Example Iraq, they had 30 Billion dinar at one time, they now have 1000 times more than that, they now have 30 Trillion. Iraq has now got their inflation under control… so now is the right time to redenominate to remove the effects of that inflation (the huge denominations). It’s basically just a way to get a fresh start. Not all countries will redenominated after inflation. Some countries are ok with having these huge denominated bills. Vietnam comes to mind. Iraq wants to start over… so a redenomination is the answer. The term RV gets mixed into this due to sloppy reporting on the part of the press. Many redenominations have been reported as a revalue and it’s wrong. They do it because in a simplistic laymens view, the old currency was worth 1/10 of a penny, the new currency is worth $1… so they simply be described it as a revalue. Yes… the currency revalues up 1000 times… but you have 1000 times less of it… so no gain. And that’s the way almost all redenominations happen. There have been cases where countries screwed their people over and caused them to lose value. I don’t believe there has ever been one redenomination where they increased people’s worth/value.
So again… to answer you question of why they do this… it’s simply a pretty standard procedure to erase the effects of past years of high inflation.
There is a great paper written by Layna Mosley from the University of North Carolina, titled Dropping Zeros, Gaining Credibility. I would suggest anyone thinking about dinar read this paper
It is a study of all the redenominations (same thing as lop) done over the last 30 or so years. Explains why countries do it, when they might do it, and why some countries don’t do it.
True currency revaluations are almost always tiny tiny movements... in the 1/2 percent range. That's why to currency traders work with huge margin to make money off such tiny moves. I've challenged dinar people to show me one single instance where any country revalued their currency upward more than 5% in one shot and they can't do it... because it dosn't exist. They usually pull out the Kuwaitt dinar story... but that is a made up lie by scammers. Kuwait never did a big RV of their currency.
Well I guess that it has to happen and from this outside view I hope it does increase for all that invested and for all involved. But what would be wrong with putting up $1000 to see what happens anyways, its like an insurance policy, if you use it and it pays off you were covered, if not what did you lose, a measely $1000. I think just like gameling and playing lotto you will spend a grand on many useless things, in this matter if you do spend the grand the worst case is you still have a grand afterwards, right?
Hey Ray, I was not attacking you by saying you are dumm or any one else on this blog! I merely am as sure as any one with any intelligance can assure you that your buddy who you beat up so diligantly is by far the the most knowledgable person on this blog with statistcal knowledge pertaining to world economy and for you to call him ignorant makes me feel you have no respect for a person with rhat level of knowledge, its way too simple to see he is very SMART and I am willing to bet he has some College degrees to back it up. I wish you well and would love to see this explode to a very big proportion so everyone gets a gift, including you sir. But please do not knock this Stew for his utter inteligance, he is just another person with his own opinion and I bet his intentions are not to hurt you or demean your inteligance , he probably feels he is warning you and contributing to helping people not make huge monetary mistakes. I am on your side and want the gain also So to any one reading this remember this blog should be about people shrpening each other and giving opinions , not a war for who is really the top dog cock daddy smart butt, yeah? By the way, thats just an opinion.
Hey Eddy:
In general, Stew is correct about the normal adjustments of various currencies around the world, but like the revaluation of the Kuwaiti Dinar (KWD), the pending RV of the Iraqi Dinar (IQD) is not a normal adjustment... both were the result of the two wars (Desert Storm & Iraq War) when the US devalued both...
Keep in mind, the the pre-war value of the IQD was around $3.22, so there is no reason that it can't be reinstated (RI) back to it's pre-war rate or revalue (RV) based on its current or projected value of Iraq's assets (such as oil, minerals, diamonds, etc), which makes it among the wealthiest counties in the world...
Also, the various countries, like the US, Great Britain, Germany, etc wouldn't have forgiven Iraq their debt if the revaluation of the IQD was only going to be 10 cents or even 1 USD...
Shabibi, the Governor of the Central Bank of Iraq, has stated that their currency is about to become the most valuable currency in the world and in order to accomplish that it will have to be higher the the Kuwaiti Dinar (KWD), which is currently around $3.63...
Because all of the Iraqi Oil Production is currently under contract with the US, Great Britain, Germany, France at $32/Barrel and under contract with Russia & China at $40/Barrel, Shabibi has stated the new value of their currency will make up the difference in order to support their 2011 Budget, so the rate will have to be at least $3.41...
If this were a scam as Stew wants you to believe, then why can I sell back any or all of my IQD back to the currency dealer that I purchased it from or why are many banks selling IQD?
Eddy, it is very easy to find negative comments about this investment or just about anything on the Internet because their are always going to be people, like Stew, who are not only uniformed, but as a result, very opinionated...
Here is my thought one way or another, I beleive the money can be exchanged when they are done and the forex trades their currency. I feel if I buy $3000 dollars worth and it goes up then yippy!! On the other hand if some fluke it doesnt, I still have the same amount I started with and did not lose. So to me its worth the gamble and I hope that people do win and not break even. Stwe , Why not try just but about 500,000 worth for about $500 and see what happens?
I’ve listened to Beitlings broadcasts for quite some time, and have agreed with most of what was said. But the 18th of November show with his friend Randy’s calculations has been rattling around in my head and isn’t sitting well…
Randy states:
(assuming Iraq will take it's 25 Trillion IQD down to 15 Billion IQD)
if you take the 25Tril IQD and divide by the target of 15Bil IQD, you get 1167 – I agree!
Then if you take the average selling price of 1169 IQD per USD or .00085543 per Dinar and multiple it by the 1167, you get .9982 per Dinar – Randy rounded up his .00085543 to .00086 and it makes a huge difference when you’re dealing with these low decimal rates. If you use his .00086, you get $1.43 vs .99 cents
This is only for a money supply reduction. Basically, I’m still getting my .00085543 per original dinar, or .9982 per Dinar after re-denomination. After all, if I have 500,000 dinars at .00085543, after re-denomination, I will have (500,000 / 1167) 428 dinars (approx).
CURRENTLY
500,000 X .00085543 = $427.71 USD VALUE
AFTER DEMONINATION USING ABOVE MATH
428 x .9982 = $427.23 USD VALUE
ZERO PROFIT! ZERO GAIN, and in fact by the time you take the additional costs into consideration of what it took to get the dinar (Broker fees, shipping fees, wire transfer fees, etc – you actually are losing money). The lower denoms, or electronic Dinar—we can always hold and hope the value goes up over time, but the large (“000”) bills that will most likely have a 15, 30, or 90 day window to redeem will likely lose us money. Most of my Dinar came from Dinar Banker, and I’d have to pay $150 to exchange it back to USD. Perhaps a bank may be cheaper, but I don’t see any way to make a profit on the larger bills—regardless of the fee.
And Let’s say the RV/Re-denomination comes out at what is a ridiculously high number of $10.00 – That’s still only applied to the new 428 dinar (from scenario above) giving us $4280.00 or .00856 per PRE-Denominized Dinar – 8/10ths of a cent (Less than a penny) on our original dinar. So some profit, but nothing even close to what people were looking at. And certainly nowhere near a 25,000 dinar note being worth $25,000!
I believe in the Iraq economy to make money -- but with the news of the denominizing the Dinar to reduce currency, I have no faith in short term profits from the Dinar. By the way -- has anyone seen an official press statement indicating the reduction from 25 Trillion IQD down to 15 Billion IQD? I saw it first on Breitlings site, but it wasn't written by a credible source within Iraq.
Anyone want to buy my 25,000 notes?
Don't you find it interesting that what you describe is a LOP... yet Breiting is saying this information vindicates him and proves the loppers wronge.
I'm telling you... these guys have been promising a huge 100,000% to 300,000% windfall for years. It is going to redenominate just like the loppers have been saying... yet these pumpers are going to claim somehow the loppers were wrong and they , the gurus, were right all along. Breitling is already doing just that.
DesertPapi... don't fall for crap about higher denoms vs lower denoms. When countries redenominate ALL denominations are replaced. There has never been a redenomination where they didn't replace all denominations. The people that fall for buying the lower denominations will be the biggest losers in this scam. They are paying up to $3000 for $850 worth of dinar. They certainly wont be given any more for those lower denoms when they try to exchange... in fact they might be given less because of the higher shipping cost for the bigger stacks of bills they have.
---Fo sure, i would love to buy your dinar! i have faith and frankly dont belive in "negitive nancies" (a good rule of thumb). you all sound like nancies! i already revealed Banker and Stew earlier in this post, and they have yet to prove themselves by a simple answer.
--- I seriouly dnt belive you guys have a true understanding. Plus i have watched , for the past yr, Stew and other nay sayers, change thier negitive storys and the otherside has not... This is hard proof to me that they are just sorry people w/o faith in much or have been done wrong somewhere in life. i wil pray for them.
---no need for reply guys, you have shown me enough negitivity w/o positive input that puts you all in the obviuos "nonsence" group.
---Dont belive these people guys. just belive in what Iraq does( what parliment does)( just the facts)-- Deversify if hav doubts.... these guys dont hav anything on the ISX, or having a bank account in IRAQ, or simply investing in the american companies that are going into Iraq.. these are great ways to invest among others like gold an silver. thanks to the Dinar investment i would hav never learned of so many ways and understand so much abt investing...
---now i have so many tools to use. this investment could go belly up and i would still be happy i found it and ignored the naysayers enough not to change. thank you God bless everyone...even Stew... 🙂
Well stated Jdog!
JDog, Ray --
I have no doubt there is potential to make money with the dinar. And I do have a Iraq account, and have no problems keeping that account.
My Theory here is the following will happen:
They CBI cancels the 1,000, 5,000, 10,000 and 25,000 bills giving us xxx days (whether in Iraq or outside or Iraq) to redeem them for replacements.
They will issue new currency to mimic our system, create 1, 5, 10, 20, 50 and 100 dinar notes.
When we redeem the large notes, the "000" will be dropped. and the 25,000 dinar note would redeem for 25, (a 20 and 5 dinar notes), the 10,000 becomes 10 dinar note, 5,000 becomes 5 dinar note, and 1,000 becomes a 1,000 note.
They raise the exchange the dinar at an amount close to where everyone seems to be expecting -- $3.00 to $4.00 per dinar?
As the large notes are redeemed they come out of circulation. Reducing the 25 trillion. And over the next 2 years the 1,000, 5,000 and 10,000 will also be taken out of circulation and replaced with the appropriate 1,5,10 dinar notes.
So, in this scenario the majority of the notes being in large denoms will be removed from circulation. You can look at the CBI publication on their website that shows how many bills are in circulation as of 12/31/2010 for confirmation.
Nobody looses -- However the large value notes don't carry the rate potential the other notes do. For instance the 250 dinar note currently worth about 21 cents would be now worth about $750 (at $3 RV price). WHere the 25,000 note worth about $21 now -- would be worth about $75.00!
Dinar held electronically in Iraq would have a large potential for gain also like the 250 note.
I do not believe that they are going to cancels all currency and divide it by 1167 or whatever to get it down to 15 million, and apply it to every outstanding bill.
Also, I believe (correct me if I'm wrong), but dinar held in bank accounts is not considered "in circulation", and would not be affected, and would not loose dinar quantity.
Anyway -- I am selling my dinar notes that I have in hand, and transferring the funds to iraq and converting to IQD in my account.
I posted a few days ago a different scenario a few days ago, that sorta freaked me out -- but the more I thought about it -- this makes more sense. Iraq wants people to trust this currency, and the scenario were they just cut it by 1167 and it comes out at .86 to 1.00 per dinar would loose money, and people would certainly loose faith in the currency.
Plus the CBI indicated the process would take a couple years. But the way everyone was talking if they cut it by 1167 to get it to 15 million, and put a 90 window (or 30) then it's done! Issue the new currency, and after the 30,60,90 window the currency is worthless anyway -- so it would be completed in 90 days. Not 2 years.
They also indicated they want to be the strongest and most valuable currency in the world -- and thats not going to happen if the citizens of IRAQ don't trust the currency, much less investors from around the world if they trust it. AND governments who have accumulated dinar in their foreign reserves.
So This follows everything that they have said they would do -- and nobody looses money. The CBI has large reserves and can cover the value adjustment.
Anyway --- Thats all... for now. HEHEHE....
Both my previous msg and this one are hypothetical scenarios. The math is accurate, So it's not that i'm ANTI dinar... I'm just cautious and want to see the calculations how things are anticipated to be handled.
I am selling whats left of my large note dinar -- currently have 1,000,000 in 25,000 notes. I'm not going to ship them out to anyone -- but there seems to be plenty of people in southern california that are involved in this -- hoping to find someone that we can do a swap so nobody gets screwed over. No offense, but to many scammers in this group...
WHHOPS, scratch this paragraph...
As the large notes are redeemed they come out of circulation. Reducing the 25 trillion. And over the next 2 years the 1,000, 5,000 and 10,000 will also be taken out of circulation and replaced with the appropriate 1,5,10 dinar notes.
------
They would be cancelled in xx days like the 25,000 -- so they would have a new bill that is 1, 5, 10...
Im glad that you guys have "exposed" me as a so called "nancies" on this topic. Fine, so be it. I used to hold dinar cash, no more based on my conclusions through research. I wish you lots of luck with this. However, some food for thought. According to Investopedia: The process whereby a countries currency is recalibrated due to significant inflation and currency devaluation. Certain currencies have been redenominated a number of times over the last century for various reasons. Simple defination of "Redenomination". Just after the war started Iraqs Dinar was "devalued". Got that? Okay good. Now, the last few years their has been talk of the new government of Iraq to redenominate the Dinar. Thats gonna happen, Im niniety-nine percent sure of that. Once that happens, I also to do belive that in due time, they will also, now sit down for this...Revalue the Dinar!! Oh my god, did he just write that? Sure did. My fellow "nancy" Stew has said that most countries "Revalue" their currency a percent or two. Small potatoes in the grand scheme of things. The ICB, controls the value of the dinar. Its not a floating currency, probably never will be too. So after the 25,000 Dinar note, becomes the "new" 25 Dinar note, at a rate of say 1-1, the CBI may or may not "Revalue" the Dinar. Lets say they revalue it 25%, now the "new" Dinar is worth .75 to one dollar, or 1.25 to one "new Dinar. Ill take it. So what is Banker getting at here? The main point to the "Dream investment" is the windfall loads of money right? Not so fast. I really do not expect the CBI to "revalue" the "new" dinar 250 to 300% after they redenominate the Dinar to that 1 "new" Dinar equals $3.00 US. So where does that leave a cash holder of the "old" dinar? Still sitting at home with your new dinar cash pile thats still worth the same. Still online checking the CBI exchange rate, waiting for that 300% mark up. This is what all the dinar dealers are selling you. That 300% revalue. So like I said in my last post, you might make 10,20, 30 grand if your lucky and or old enough to see it. Oh by the way just heard DB is having a 75% off sale on all dinar notes.
I'm like you banker... I'm still trying to figure out how I was "revealed".
Look guys... Iraq has stated that they will redenominate just like all the other countries have redenominated. They have used other countries as examples, Turkey and Russia. They have stated that many other countries have done the same process.
In every redenomination, not some, EVERY redenomination involves issuing a new currency. The CBI has stated many times they will issue a new currency. The new currency totally replaces the old currency. Anyone who thinks the current small notes will be treated any differently is making a huge mistake. No redenomination has ever done that and Iraq certainly won’t do it either. ALL currency will be replaced at a rate of 1000 old for 1 new... no matter what denomination you have. I should clarify that. Every Iraqi will get 1 new dinar for every 1000 old dinar he has. Absolutely all bank accounts will also have 3 zeros removed. If you have 5,375,450 dinar in a bank account, after the redenomination you will have 5,375.45 dinar in your account.
If you hold dinar in a shoebox halfway around the world from Iraq, who knows what you will get. You will not get the 1 new for 1000 old for free. You will at the very least have to pay a dinar dealer a few hundred bucks to do the exchange for you... and that's only if they can get the new dinar... which I doubt they will be able to get. The next option will be the dealers will give you dollars back... but that's only if they can get the dinar back into Iraq for exchange. But don't be surprised if they can't do that... so they close up shop and disappear and your stuck with stinky worthless dinar.
Dog... you are hilarious dude. The pumpers have had a new reason every week for why this big RV has happen at any second. It goes back years. It was the election. Then the constitution. Then the end of the first Stand By Arrangement, Every year it's just gotta revalue for the budget to work... LOL... seven years in row now suckers have fallen for that one. Then it's Chapter 7, Then it's WTO. Then it's Hydrocarbon Law... it's on and on... I've missed hundreds of stupid reason they have given that it MUST RV... the best of all is the simple "It Must RV". Dinar pumpers have changed their story more than most people change underwear.
Iraq has been talking about redenominating the currency since the summer of 2006. I was predicting a redenomination before then and have simply tried to explain redenominations to people ever since then. My story has not waivered 1 inch on the dinar through that whole time.
There are few different outcomes for dinar holders... as I described above. It will depend on the length of the exchange period and just how much Iraq enforces their currency laws. Remember... all this dinar that has left Iraq to be sold to speculators is considered smuggled illegal dinar. Those are pretty much the only thing up in that air though. The redenomination will be done just like all redenominations have been done in the past. New currency to totally replace old currency. No exceptions.
Hey Stew & Banker:
I'm glad that you guys have each other because post RV of the IQD, you both are going to wonder what happened and then can console each other...
This is from the Central Bank Iraq...
"By 1987 the banking system consisted of the Central Bank, the Rafidain Bank, the Agricultural, Industrial, and Real Estate banks. A 5 percent devaluation reduced the value of the dinar to US$3.2169, the official rate which remained until the Gulf War, although in late 1989, the black market rate was reported to be 1.86 dinars for US$1.
1990 - 2003
After the Gulf War in 1991, and due to the economic blockade, the previously used Swiss printing technology was no longer available. A new, inferior quality notes issue was produced. The previous issue became known as the Swiss dinar and continued to circulate in the Kurdish region of Iraq. Due to excessive government printing of the new notes issue, the dinar devalued quickly, and in late 1995, US$1 was valued at 3,000 dinars."
So, straight from the central bank of Iraq, they state the dinar had dropped to 1.86 dinar to dollar, or 54 cents per dinar by 1989... and then DUE TO EXCESSIVE GOVERNMENT PRINTING it was down to 3000 dinar per dollar in 1995... 16 years ago.
Anyone claiming the dinar was $3 before the latest war, and was artificially moved down by the US, the IMF, or any other entity... is either a lying scammer pumping dinar, or someone who has fallen for the lies told by the scammers.
What is the incentive for the US to revalue the Iraqi Dinar to the highest currency in the world? Well, look at this senario... the top curreny is the Kuwaiti Dinar at $3.63 per US dollar... if the Us revalued the Iraqi Dinar to say, $4... this would give the US, who is sitting on 4 trillion Iraqi Dinars, a whopping $16 trillion dollars! Last time I checked the UD National Debt was a tad over $15 trillion dollars! Imagine whiping out the US debt overnight? After bringing home the troops in 2012 and whiping out the National Debt wouldnt you think that Barack Obama is the greatest President ever?
Will someone please tell my dreamer boyfriend this info? LOL
Really, thanks for all he helpful information. I really appreciate it. It's hard to find the truth. Too many Dinar Gurus/sellers and hopeful Bible-thumpers with "faith" in the
Dinar. It's hard to believe they really think they're going
to get rich on this. No, it's not a true scam because the Dinar is a real currency. However, the investment opportunity is a real scam. Oh, by the way, it's going to happen this Monday. The gurus only tell the truth from the most reliable sources, you know.
Wanda... I can tell you one thing for sure. You boyfriend will find absolutely no truth on dinar sites. It's staggering. Practically 100% of what they sat about the dinar is made up lies and misinterpretations. They ban anyone who dares tell the truth... it's not good for sales.
Wanda:
There is plenty of good information out there regarding this investment, but too many (like Stew) love to focus on the negative... If you choose to, you can find negative information on just about anything on the Internet...
You can certainly choose to believe Stew who is totally clueless and then regret it after the Iraqi Dinar (IQD) revalues...
There is little risk because the dealers, like Dinar Banker, will buy back your IQD if you were to ever decide not to remain invested.... Do you really believe a very wealthy country like Iraq can participate in the world economy with worthless currency...
Even Shabibi, the Governor of the Central Bank of Iraq, said recently that the IQD will be the most valuable currency in the middle east very soon...
Keep in mind, the Kuwaiti Dinar is currently valued at $3.63, so if the IQD is currently worth about 1/10 of a penny and in order to become the most valuable currency in the middle east, post RV, it would have to be worth more than $3.63... as a result, you will have an incredible ROI...
Wanda, what is a bigger risk: listening to Stew or listening to me? You be the judge...
Wanda… these are the exact type of lies you deal with on Dinar sites.
“Do you really believe a very wealthy country like Iraq can participate in the world economy with worthless currency”
Their currency is not worthless and the exchange rate has nothing to do with them participating in the world economy. Italy had an exchange rate of 1500:1 for the Lira for years and years prior to joining the Euro. Italy had one of the 5 biggest economies in the world with that 1500:1 rate. It’s simple ignorance to claim they have to have a certain rate to participate.
“Even Shabibi, the Governor of the Central Bank of Iraq, said recently that the IQD will be the most valuable currency in the middle east very soon”
Shabibi has never said this. This is a massive distortion of what he said. Shabibi claimed the dinar would be the STRONGEST currency in the middle east… in fact I think he stated that it already is the strongest in the middle east. Whether a currency is strong or weak has NOTHING to do with the exchange rate. It has to do with backing the currency. Iraq has over 100% backing of their currency with FX reserves. That makes it a strong currency. I don’t know off had what the % of backing Kuwait has… but if they only back 90% of it… then the Kuwaiti dinar at $3.60 is weaker than the Iraqi dinar at 1170:1.
This has all been explained over and over to the dinar pumpers and gurus. The fact that they ignore the truth and continue to push the same lies over and over proves that they are crooks.
Hey Wanda:
This will be my last post to you regarding this subject because I could care less if you want to believe me or not...
What you have to ask yourself is where is my biggest risk, listening to Stew, which will result in no opportunity to make a dime or listening to me, which could result in making a lot of money depending on what you are willing to invest...
The ball is i your court, not mine or in Stew's...
Dumbfouded by Desert Papis explaination of the revalue! So if I have 800 million dinar in Iraq today, when they revalue I will only have about 80000 us dollars because I had it in 25000 denoms. But if I live in Iraq and have 3,200,000 dinar I will have 2,400,000,000 US dollars because I have it in 250 denoms??????? What the hell??? So if you live in Iraq and are poor as hell you are now powerfull if you were not rich enough to own it in 25000 denoms and if you were powerfull and rich you now are a broke ass idiot because you were not smart enough to own it in 250s. Not really sure you won my vote with that, not meaning to say you are wrong or do not know what you are talking about but if I am owner of millions of dollars and my neighbor only has 10,000 when we revalue we trade places? O.K. You need to break that down in a different way. I dont see how you trade cause of denom #s? May be Stew has an incite on that brilliant scenario? Or any one who is smart please interpret this strange to me way of trading places.
Eddy… dealers are selling lower denominations for $3000 per million. Don’t you think they’re pretty happy when they sell lower denominations. It’s a SCAM!!
When countries redenominate… every time a country redenominates, not some times… EVERY TIME a country redenomnates they replace all denominations. This whole idea that Iraq will treat the large and small denominations differently is nonsense. It is made up garbage by dinar dealers and their paid pumpers.
When the redenomination is enacted… Irqis will have to exchange ALL of their current dinars for the new dinars. They will have to give 1000 current dinars to get 1 new dinar. The new dinars will have sub-dinar denominations… like ½ dinar, 1/4 dinar, 1/10 and 1/20 dinar. Just like our quarter, dime and nickel. If for some reason, an Iraqi only has 1 current 50 dinar to turn in… they will get back a 1/20 dinar, or same as a nickel.
I am so confident of this that I’m willing to offer big bill insurance. Give me $100 for every million dinar of big bills you want to insure. If they RV the small note and not the big notes, I will make up the difference. I would be scamming you.
Hey Eddy: I see you are apparently believing Stew's BS and if so, you are about miss out on a terrific investment...
Ray... maybe you can give us a couple examples of redenominations where they only replaced the biggest bills and left the lower bills and RV'd them. You don't even need a couple... how about just one example of a country doing that.
[offensive comment removed by Editor - please keep all comments civil!]
[offensive comment removed by Editor - please keep all comments civil!]
Beleiving what Stew said or any body else, What I was saying is how retarded the Desert Papis statement was, I hope he did not go out and by $5,000. worth of little bills hoping that is where the the big bang is. If this returns a bundle beyond every ones investment then Amen to that but why beleive someone who is being scammed by the money pumpers to buy little denoms? Revalue, reconstruct, rebuild , whatever, Percentages are percentages.
Instead of holding hard currency, will having an account in, say Al Wark Bank, protect and "investor" from the RV. For example, if one hold 1 mil Iqd pre-LOP, then when it LOP's it's down to 1ooo IQD. But if one ahs 1 Million IQD held digitally like in teh bank when it LOP's, does he still have the same amount--1 million IQD, not a thousand?
Hey Tim:
Where are you getting the idea that the IQD will LOP?
That is only a possibility with high inflation, which is not even an issue in Iraq...
Hey Tim:
Where are you getting the idea that the IQD will LOP? That is only a possibility with high inflation, which is not even an issue in Iraq...
That is a flat out lie Ray... who ever told you that is a scam artist. It has been proven to all the gurus that lops happen AFTER high inflation, and are best done once inflation has been bought under control. Exactly like Iraq has done. Many countries have lopped with single digit inflation. Again... the proof has been shown to the gurus. The fact that they continue to spout that lie proves they are decietful scammers.
Tim... when the lop happens, as the CBI has said 100 or so times it will, even bank accounts will be lopped. Same as hard currency. 1000 old for 1 new. The advantage would be that a bank will do this transaction for you for free... no fees. Unlike the holders of currency outside of Iraq. They will have to deal with the same crooks that sold them this stuff to try to get rid of it. They will pay a huge fee.
This is from a university study of lops.
"Hypothesis 2: Redenomination is more likely following a period of high inflation and a subsequent stabilization. A dramatic downward movement in inflation increases the probability of a redenomination."
Even Turkey, which the CBI continues to use an example of what they will do. They lopped with single digit inflation.
FRom the UNC study.
"Indeed, 2004 was the first year of single-digit inflation in Turkey since 1972, making 2005 an apt time to reinforce the commitment to low inflation."
If you want to read the entire study... just search for "Dropping zeros gaining credibilty".
Stew,
How many times have you described the re denomination process on this site? Just tell them they are right...they are gonna be rich!
I cant wait till the lopp happens and all the suckers start barking!
I have been searcuing and looking everywhere to find any evidence that this so called EV is actually an RV. All I can find is that this is no more than a Redinomination of Bills that makes no differencein value. Is there any one out there that can produce a link or document proving that Iraq is doing somthing different by changing this by deleting 0's then giving a 1000% return for trading old currency. Please no retarded come backs like Shabibi said they would have the most powerfull currency, all he is saying is they have some powerfull supply of Oil reserves to back up their debt. So you guys that argue this RV as a return in 100 fold please guide me to a site, link or official document that is not givin by these so called GURUS that cry (WOLF) Rv is happening any minute with a return so high it is only known in the certain circle of people that own this paper Dinar. I will beleve what you beleive if you can find some real evidence to prove this what I am calling a dream Theory! Good luck who ever you are and I am on your side when I get to see this, Thanks
Without a doubt, one of the most entertaining exchanges I've read thus far on this investment/scam (depending which side of the fence you're on)!! LOL! Hilarious! But the two questions I always come back to are:
1.) If one is so vehemently against this investment, why even visit articles on the topic, and fight so hard to convince others that it's a scam?
2.) If one personally believes in the investment, why get so emotionally wrapped up to the point of spewing expletives anytime someone states facts that don't support the investment?
For me, I think the the takeaway is clear...if you believe, only invest what you can afford to lose. Think Vegas or the lottery. Yes, you can absolutely turn your dinars in today to the broker you bought them from. That is a fact. That fact takes it outta the "scam" category for me. BUT, the brokers (the only entities making millions off of this investment thus far) are gonna take their cut when you turn the dinar back in (27%+, in my calculations). Certainly not a trivial fee!
I'm an entrepreneur, have been all my life. I typically don't like to gamble because I like to have a bit of control over my money (note: "risk", which entrepreneurs are quite familiar with, does not necessarily equate to "gambling"). But when I do go to Vegas, I'll take, say, $300 out to blow on the games, with ZERO expectation to pay bills with it tomorrow. It's entertainment, little more.
Only with THIS investment/gamble/whatever, that $300 gets me 250,000 chips that may one day yield me a pretax profit approaching a cool mil. Plus, a nice long ride of watching gurus say things like...
"That article was just smoke and mirrors!"
"Tears on my keyboard...the ride is over, the RV is here!"
"Shabibi gave the codeword to enact the RV: 'Scissortail, Scissortail, Scissortail'!!"
"I"m standing outside the bank right now waiting to cash in!"
"They are cashing out in Kuwait as we speak! A bank's parking lot is full of Ferrari's, Lamborghini's, and Bentley's belonging to preferred bank clients who've been allowed to cash out first!"
and my favorite....
"You're BANNED, my friend!!"
LOL! I'm in it til the end, and enjoying this extended "Vegas" trip! Keep your chin up, everyone...regardless of your stance.
"First rule about business, never get emotional about stocks...clouds your judgement." - Gordon Gekko, 1985 🙂
Still yet to hear from the GURU's hall of fame. One of those guys called OIL MAN yelled out WOLF, I mean RV last week, I dont know if he feels stupid but should. All I know is there is some evidence of something going to happen, but none that it is an RV and not a Redinom of currency. My post was to challenge the the GURUs who have manipulated people all this time to buy Dinar cause "it is ready tommorrow" or "it just happend, get ready". I want these guys to step up to the plate with more than SECRET bull Sh it and show people where this secret crap comes from and produce some evidence, documents or links to a real site producing facts! Any one reading this send it to those forums and show it to those GOOBERU's, I mean GURU's and get them to take this challenge and dance with it! Come on, some one out there can propose this, right? Seriuosly, do it!
Dear God are people still getting suckered by this scam and the pumper scammers? "RV tomorrow" - every other day since 2008...
"[DinarDaddy] I heard from one contact that said a source of his told him there is a 100% chance of RV by Monday the 21st [Dec 2009]." - Dec 18 2009
"Stew" gets it. If you want to know what's going to happen to the Iraqi Dinar, look at what happened to the Venezuelan Bolivar on Jan 1st 2008. (They have lots of oil too - twice as much as Iraq in fact...)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_proven_oil_reserves
You know the old saying… There’s a sucker born every second.
So it’s not surprising that people would come along and fall for this scam. But it is surprising, and quite sad, that people fall for the scam and even after being in it for years, still believe the crap these con men put forth.
I remember long ago, 6 or 7 years ago, I started telling dinar holders a redenomination was coming. The gurus and their followers called me nuts and many other foul things and banned me from dinar boards for even mentioning redenomination/lop. I was pretty happy to see redenomination, delete 3 zero articles start to stream out of Iraq. I figured that would put an end to this scam. I never underestimated the gurus ability to twist and bend the articles to mean something different, but I had faith that the majority of the people invested would have the comprehension skills the see that the gurus were full of crap. Sadly… I was wrong on that.
I purchased a million dinar last month and was lucky to sell it to another person for the amount I paid the Dinar Dealer. "I wanted Out!"
This has got to be the biggest scam of all time.
Listen, .... Iraq isn't going to RV and allow Americans to become easy millionaires and Billionaires, .. "what's wrong with me in thinking such foolish crap!"
No doubt, Iraq will scrap the Present Dinar and make new money before they RV the country as a whole.
I feel so stupid for falling into this Scam but I got out as fast as I could while getting all my money back. "Thank Goodness!"
Hey political-realist:
If the investment in the Iraqi Dinar (IQD) were a scam, how is that you could have sold what you purchased from the Dinar dealer back to them for about 80% of what you paid for it? Also, keep in mind, you can also buy IQD from most of the major banks, who would not be involved in a scam...
Congratulations, you found an informed invester who was willing to pay you 100% of what you paid for it...
Keep in mind, because investors like myself represent less than 1% of all those who have invested in the IQD (the other 99% are countries, like the US, China, Great Britain, Germany & France), therefore Iraq could care less if any of us become millionaires as a result...
Also, keep in mind, the pre-war value of the IQD was $3.22, so why would you believe that one of the wealthiest countries in the world couldn't RV back to it previous value in order to participate in the global market? To date, they can only participate in the global market with the USD because the IQD is only currently valued at only about 1/10th of penny?
Also the Kuwaiti Dinar (KWD) also went through a similar revalue back in the 90's to about $3.50 (currently valued at around $3.60) and they don't have the resources that Iraq has, therefore the Iraqi IQD should revalue for more than the KWD...
Post RV, I hope you will revisit this site and share with us how you feel then...
CBI said they wanted to ease cash transactions in the country and also make people on the street carry LESS paper money than they do now.
They also said the redenomination would not affect the people of Iraq's wealth. So if you redenominate the current bills for lower denoms and leave the exchange rate the same as it is now , wouldnt that make people carry around 3 times the paper money on the street it just doesnt make any sense. If youre not gonna affect the peoples wealth with a redenomination then youre supposed to give/exchange an Iraqi citizen's 25000 note for the same 25000 dinars just with new lower denomination notes. So before the Iraqi citizen was carrying around 25000 dinars with a 25k note but now with the lower denoms he gets to carry around the same 25k value but with 2-times 3-times 4-times the amount of paper money.
If they leave the exchange rate the same and introduce lower denoms again ....
1. how does that increase purchasing power for the citizens
2. how does that ease cash transactions in the country
3. how does that make them carry around LESS paper money
It is just MY OPINION that what makes sense is to introduce lower denoms to the market but also set/change the exchange rate or value of the dinar for the new lower denoms to work and help them acomplish those 3 things. I dont believe in $3+ revalues or anything like that but I do believe a change in the exchange rate is gonna go hand in hand with the introduction of the lower denoms.
In MY OPINION anywhere from 0.01 cents to 0.86 cents.
LMAO and SMH
Hey Stew:
We will see who will LMAO and SMH...
Please promise to come back and visit after you cash in for millions.
Hey Stew: It will be my please 🙂
I see the debate rolls on....LOL...
But, I do have one question that has plagued me for quite some time, and actually follows Yuri's thought above. Perhaps someone could shed some light on what I'm missing in this hypothetical scenario:
Coca Cola sells a bottle of Coke to a store in downtown Baghdad for $1.00USD. The store owner, not being very savvy, decides he will sell that bottle to Iraqi citizens at cost, for the dinar equivalent of $1.00USD.
Lets say the current exchange rate is 1,000 dinars to 1 USD, for ease of math.
Currently, a citizen can purchase that bottle for a single 1,000 dinar note.
Iraq drops those zeros...
Coca Cola hasn't dropped its selling price of that bottle...
So, if the shop is still going to sell that bottle at cost, a citizen has to use either 5 200 dinar notes (the largest lower denoms scheduled for release, from what I hear), or an even larger number of smaller denominated bills.
This would not be easing commerce, as they've said was the point of going through this excercise. Now, granted, homegrown Iraqi-produced products will just have the zeros dropped from the price as well, no problem there. But if they are trying to encourage international trade, as Shabibi said many times, including in his speech at the US Chamber of Commerce last year, then what is the missing piece?
The only response I've ever heard to that was that it would initially be an in-country LOP and later increase the rate once they move to Article VIII (internationally tradable currency).
Any thoughts on this scenario? And if at all possible, please keep the vitriol as well the fanaticism out of the response...this is just business, my friends.
Thanks!
Here is the question I have with the Dinar. Why would anyone who sells dinar (especially brokers who have purchased them at various rates/dinar over time) sell them? They would have to be idiots to sell something at 40% over book value when they stand to make (in their words) millions in USD per million dinar. They would horde what they have in inventory. It makes no sense!
The brokers churn (which is illegal per the SEC) worthless paper on poor schmucks who get caught up in the get rich quick scheme. Every sale/trade puts USD in the brokers’ pockets. What will they say to their “investors” when it is time to cash out and the paper is worth maybe nothing or maybe $1,160 USD per million dinar? I bet they leave the country in a hurry.
Gekko. When Iraq redenominates they will do just as every other country has done when they redenominated. This is nothing new and has been done over 100 times in other countries. You seem to be under the impression they are only removing 3 zero notes. That is a made up lie by dinar gurus. In every redenomination a new currency is introduced and ALL old denominations are removed. They will issue currency similar to we have here in the US. 100, 50, 20, 10, 5, 1, .5, .25, .10, .05. All of this new currency will have an exchange rate of 85 cents per dinar. All of the current currency will keep its .00085 rate and will be phased out over a period if time. During that time the shop owner selling the coke will accept either 1000 of the current dinar or 1 of the new issued dinar. Say someone pays with an old 10,000 dinar note, the shop owner could give back 9,000 current dinar or 9 of the new dinar as change. Iraqis will start getting their salaries paid in new dinar. If they made 100,000 dinar per week before, they will now get 100 dinar per week.
This is how all countries that redenominate do it. Nothing new here. The only thing confusing is that there are a bunch of people selling dinar who are doing their best to confuse people on the issue so that they will buy dinar.
Ray - "If the investment in the Iraqi Dinar (IQD) were a scam, how is that you could have sold what you purchased from the Dinar dealer back to them for about 80% of what you paid for it?"
The scam isn't being able to buy and sell the currency, the scam is the deliberate hyped mis-selling of selling it alongside a promise $1,000 will become $1m with a mythical "RV", often by traders who give pumpers a "backhand" cut from the exchange fees (some of which are absolutely extortionate) of the Dinar dealer that the pumper advertise.
It's like penny stock "pump & dump" scams - the stocks themselves are legal to trade - but misselling them they will leap up in value on the back of unsubstantiated rumors created by the sellers is a scam. Same with past mis-selling pension investments. I know it takes a while to sink in for some who are absolutely hooked onto non-existent "secret intel", but Dinar dealers do not get rich from holding Dinar's - they get rich from *selling* them...
In fact, at least one well known Dinar pumper has been caught using several fake names "pumping" penny stock's years long before the Dinar craze came along. Some of us have been long term Forex traders and have seen all sorts of things come and go.
Ray - "Congratulations, you found an informed invester who was willing to pay you 100% of what you paid for it…"
Swapping one currency for another is no more "investing" than buying Euro's for a European vacation is "investing". It's just changing up money no different to what anyone who has even been abroad at any point in their lives has done...
Ray - "Also, keep in mind, the pre-war value of the IQD was $3.22, so why would you believe that one of the wealthiest countries in the world couldn’t RV back to it previous value in order to participate in the global market? To date, they can only participate in the global market with the USD because the IQD is only currently valued at only about 1/10th of penny?"
WRONG. The Iraqi Dinar was introduced in 1932 replacing the Indian rupee (used due to British occupation in WW1) at a rate of 1 Dinar per 13.5 rupees. It was pegged par the British £ then the peg was switched to the US$ at a rate of 1 Dinar = $2.8. In the 1970's, the Dinar rose to 1 Dinar = 3.3778 which remained until the Gulf War. This peg value was mostly artificial, evidence of which lies in the fact the black market rate was 6x higher ($1 = 3 Dinars) meaning no-one was willing to pay it's 1:3 *over-valued* arbitrary peg in reality even with Iraq's oil industry in full flow. This value was using what are called "Swiss Dinars" (due to Swiss printing plates used) and they were relatively strong vs the $ because they weren't overprinted.
After sanctions, Swiss printing was no longer available and new inferior quality "Saddam Dinars" were introduced and due to massive printing, they were rapidly devalued to below 1000:1. The sad truth is, most people who use this 1 Dinar = $3 of the old Swiss Dinar as an "RV" benchmark don't even realize that the "RV" old-to-new value correction they're waiting for already took place in 2003 when holders of the old Swiss Dinar changed them up at a rate of 150:1 for the NID (New Iraq Dinar)! ie, they were given 150 New Dinars for each old Swiss Dinar they handed in, whereas the Saddam Dinar were exchanged only for 1:1 for the NID to correct the value discrepancy between the old 3:1 Swiss Dinar (long been demonetized) and the newer never had a 3:1 value NID notes (which everyone owns today).
The over-printed NID (and Saddam Dinars) have never ever had any exchange rate even remotely approaching 3:1. Only the pre-1991 "Swiss Dinars" did, and that 150:1 "RV" already took place back in 2003, long before most modern Dinar speculators even bought NID's post 2003. The only way of getting back to near parity vs the $ is via a lop. There's simply no 3:1 value to "restore" the Dinar to via an RV because the NID's never had that value in the first place. And most Dinar holders have never, ever held pre Gulf War 1 (early 1990's) Swiss Dinar's that did have a 3:1 value.
The reason the Dinar is so weak is because it's so overprinted (like 1930's German currency). There are 30 trillion Dinars in a country with a population of 30m people (1m each - a country full of millionaires = everything gets devalued like Zimbabwe). Compare that to Kuwait with approx 33bn Kuwaiti Dinars spread across a few million people). The Iraqi Dinar is worth 1,000x less for the same reason the Zimbabwe dollar plummeted - they've printed too much. It really is that simple.
The "RV" you are waiting for and that pumpers are promising relating to the "It used to be worth 3:1 vs the dollar misinformation" already took place in 2003 when Iraq moved from its split Saddam vs Swiss Dinar (used in anti-Saddam Kurdish areas) to a singular national current New Iraqi Dinar. All that's left now is a lop that will knock off the 3 zeroes. There will be no "RV" because the NID has never had any other value other what it is today. The fact its predecessor was worth more is as totally irrelevant as the fact the Irish pound was worth more than the Euro.
And the fact Iraq has oil is utterly irrelevant. Nationalised oil is used to back foreign *debts*, not fiat currencies themselves. The Iraq Dinar is not on a "liquid gold standard", nor is any other oil rich country. Venezuela has more oil than Iraq - and they lopped. Iraq still doesn't even have a serious reliable 24/7 electricity grid.