History’s lesson for the dinar

I used to think that rapid increases in Iraqi oil production would practically guarantee a significant strengthening of the dinar over the next ten years. Surprisingly, however, history suggests that this is far from a foregone conclusion.

While the Oil Ministry claims that Iraqi capacity will rise by 10 million barrels per day (mn bbl/d) to something like 12 mn bbl/d by the end of this decade, few analysts take this projection seriously. In fact, no country has ever achieved such a large incremental increase in a ten-year period. Historically, a recent study by the Energy Policy Research Foundation (available at http://www.eprinc.org/pdf/EPRINC-Iraq-FirstLook.pdf) found that Saudi Arabia came closest, with an increase of about 6 mn bbl/d (up 150%) from 1970 – 79, followed by Iran, which went from around 2 – 6 mn bbl/d from 1965 – 1974, and Russia, which raised production by some 4 mn bbl/d (68%) from 1998 – 2007.

But suppose for the sake of argument that Iraq was able to match these precedents and raised production from approximately 2 mn bbl/d at present to, say, 6 mn bbl/d by 2019. What would happen to the dinar if it followed a trajectory similar to the Saudi riyal, Iranian rial, or Russian ruble during the oil booms in those three countries?

Not much, as it turns out. If it’s like the riyal or the ruble, the dinar would actually depreciate in US dollar terms by 25% or 16%, respectively. And the rial appreciated by just 12% from 1965 – 1974. (See chart. As the indices are based on year-end US$/local currency exchange rates, increases/decreases in an index correspond to appreciation/depreciation against the dollar.)

The problem with the idea that increased oil production must be bullish for the dinar is that it is based on the assumption that nothing changes except the output of oil (what economists call a “ceteris paribus” assumption). In fact, however, many other things can be expected to change. In the case of a large country like Russia, for example, domestic demand for refined products may rise significantly as well so that exports don’t go up at the same pace as crude production volumes. In the Saudi and Iranian cases, oil booms led to import booms, with the result that demand for foreign exchange rose along with increased export earnings. There might also be scenarios in which an increasingly confiscatory taxation regime led to greater dollar demand due to capital flight. And of course exporting more barrels won’t necessarily lead to higher forex revenues during an oil-price slump.

History’s lesson for the dinar is that whether it strengthens or weakens over the next decade will depend not only on Iraq’s success in increasing oil production but also on the economic changes that this increased production induces. If Iraqi demand for imports and refined products were frozen for ten years at current levels, a 4 mn bbl/d production increase would be unambiguously dinar positive. But in a more realistic scenario, supply and demand for foreign exchange are likely to grow together, with the result that the exchange rate may not deviate dramatically from its current level.

600 Responses to History’s lesson for the dinar

  1. Stew 2nd February 2011 at 16:37 #

    Hey Yippie... rememebr the other day you called me an idiot for saying the CBI was selling dollars. You claimed it was the other way around.
    Read this....

    BAGHDAD / Aswat al-Iraq: The Central Bank of Iraq (CBI) dollar sales jumped on Wednesday to $190.514 million at an exchange rate of 1170 Iraqi dinars per dollar, compared to the previous session’s $73.750 million.

    “The demand hit $1.749 in cash today, covered at an exchange rate of 1,183 Iraqi dinars per dollar, and $188.765 million in foreign transfers outside the country, covered at an exchange rate of 1,183 Iraqi dinars per dollar,” according to a CBI news bulletin received by Aswat al-Iraq news agency.

    None of the 18 banks that participated in today’s session offered to sell dollars.

    The Central Bank of Iraq runs a daily auction from Sunday to Thursday.

    Note.... CBI DOLLAR SALES JUMPED.
    The banks are selling dinar back to the CBI who is selling dollars.
    Note at the bottom. NONE of the 18 banks offered to sell dollars.
    I’m sure you’ll apologize to the board for misleading them and for calling me an idiot.

  2. gr 3rd February 2011 at 11:33 #

    http://works.bepress.com/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1003&context=warren_coats
    Introduction
    Monetary policy in Iraq is driven largely by three elements, only two of which are under the control of the Central Bank of Iraq (CBI). These elements are: a) the foreign exchange inflows from oil sales, military expenditures, donor and NGO expenditures and the extent to which they are spent domestically, b) the sales of some of this foreign currency back to the market in the CBI’s daily FX auctions, and c) dinar interest rates resulting from the CBI’s dinar operations.
    Iraq enjoys a large inflow of foreign currency from its oil exports, U.S. military expenditures in Iraq and domestic expenditures by donors and NGOs. The general environment in which policy takes place, in addition to the well known and very serious security problems, is an economy in which oil production is about 85 percent of GDP (three quarters of which is exported), per capita income is in the neighborhood of 1,500 U.S. dollars per annum, and government expenditures are around 90 percent of GDP. This is not a typical economy. On the other hand, M2 is about 45 percent of GDP and the deposit component of M2 has increased unevenly from around 40 percent at the beginning of 2005 to around 50 percent currently, ratios more typical of relatively developed economies.
    The CBI’s primary monetary policy goal is to maintain the value of the Iraqi dinar. Its primary instrument for achieving this goal is targeting the exchange rate of the dinar for U.S. dollars. A monetary policy based on targeting the exchange rate determines the external value of the dinar directly and its domestic value indirectly. The dinar price of the U.S. dollar (the exchange rate) indirectly determines the dinar price of American goods and services or of any tradable goods and services priced in dollars. Thus in general the price of tradable goods in dinars depends on the American dollar price of those goods and the dinar/dollar exchange rate. The dinar inflation rate, at least with respect to tradable goods, will tend to equal the dollar inflation rate less the rate of appreciation of the exchange rate.
    One useful way of characterizing the determination of the dinar price level and inflation rate is that it is the result of equating the supply and demand for dinars. By offering whatever amount of dollars the market wants at the CBI’s target exchange rate the CBI determines the exchange rate and the market determines the quantity of dinars it holds at the implied price level. In this way, the inflows of dollars and other foreign currencies from oil and other exports, foreign military, and donors that are not used to finance imports and that exceed the domestic economy’s demand to add to its currency holdings are reexported and invested abroad. This mechanism brings about the necessary balance between capital inflows and outflows (the balance of payments), without the need for government imposed restrictions (capital controls).

  3. Stew 3rd February 2011 at 15:56 #

    Nice article GR
    Let’s look at what it says.
    “On the other hand, M2 is about 45 percent of GDP and the deposit component of M2 has increased unevenly from around 40 percent at the beginning of 2005 to around 50 percent currently”
    Iraq’s GDP is about $110 billion dollars, or 128 Trillion dinars.
    M2 is about 45% of that, which is about 58 Trillion dinar.
    And 50 percent of that is deposits; the rest is currency in circulation.
    So that’s about 29 trillion deposits, 29 trillion in circulation.
    Matches up pretty well with what they report on the CBI and IMF websites.
    And again proves the dealers and pumpers are full of crap when they try to tell you those numbers are a lie.
    That much currency will never ever see a big RV... perfect for a lop.

  4. gr 3rd February 2011 at 21:10 #

    The point you so graciously overlooked is that dinars are not being sold or auctioned.

    If anybody on here, ANYBODY, thinks you know or claim to know when, if, how high the dinar will RV or lop, you're full of it. There is nobody outside the GOI who is privy to that information. So, where you think it will or will not, you're just speculating. That goes from Stew to the bottom of this barrel.

    I buy dinar. I hold dinar. I await the outcome.

  5. James 3rd February 2011 at 21:40 #

    gr, finally someone who is right on here , Stew that goes for you too my man no one knows whats going down and that's a fact , gr i have dinars and i will hold out i didn't spend more than i couldn't afford so therefor if it does not go are way no biggie "but if it does"

  6. gr 3rd February 2011 at 21:46 #

    Right, James. I bought what I was comfortable buying, and I have plenty of money left in the bank, my bills are paid. I didn't go out on a limb. While no one can guarantee it will or will not increase, common sense would tell you that it will not decrease. I would be highly elated to see it soon reach the value of the dollar. I would do flips if it ever reinstated to $3.22. Either way, the dinar I hold, I could easily sell it right now and get all my money back. So, I have lost nothing in this investment. People who buy lottery tickets and don't hit, that lottery ticket goes in the trash. Same with any type of gamble. But, at least on the IQD, you can always resell it and get your money back. So, you lose nothing.

  7. Stew 3rd February 2011 at 22:46 #

    GR... I'm not sure what your saying about dinars not being auctioned or sold.

    The article clearly states... "the sales of some of this foreign currency back to the market in the CBI’s daily FX auctions"

    The CBI sells dollars, or buys back dinar, whichever way you want to look at it... at the daily auctions.

    Think about it this way... The CBI holds the daily auctions. The banks show up and the banks make the demand, either to buy or sell dinars. The CBI just meets the demand of the banks. Currently... and for a long time now... the banks have been selling back billions of dinars daily to the CBI.
    Pretty stupid move to sell back something that's sure to RV 100,000% any day now.
    The CBI then takes those dinar and puts them back into the system through budgetary spendng and such.
    It's a big dinar circle that is fueled by dollars they get from selling oil.

  8. gr 3rd February 2011 at 23:51 #

    Introduction
    Monetary policy in Iraq is driven largely by three elements, only two of which are under the control of the Central Bank of Iraq (CBI). These elements are: a) the foreign exchange inflows from oil sales, military expenditures, donor and NGO expenditures and the extent to which they are spent domestically, b) the sales of some of this foreign currency back to the market in the CBI’s daily FX auctions, and c) dinar interest rates resulting from the CBI’s dinar operations.
    Please read b)the sales of some of this foreign currency back to the market in the CBI’s daily FX auctions.

    Stew, you stated: "Think about it this way… The CBI holds the daily auctions. The banks show up and the banks make the demand, either to buy or sell dinars."

    Exactly...

    CBI is not selling dinars to pumpers and dealers as 'some' people on here keep implying.

  9. gr 3rd February 2011 at 23:52 #

    CBI is conducting business with IRAQI BANKS. Not American Dinar Dealers.

  10. LZ 4th February 2011 at 05:16 #

    Does anyone think God is going to give us this blessing?

  11. Stew 4th February 2011 at 07:31 #

    GR... what difference does it make where the dealers are getting their dinar from? For 7 years now they have been getting tons of it and selling it. There have been buying frenzies all over the world.
    I posted auction information because someone called me an idiot for saying the CBI was selling dollars. Your article backs up my statement 100%. Thanks.
    Did you see this part of the article I posted above.
    "and $188.765 million in foreign transfers outside the country"

    Still... Not sure what your point is?

  12. James 4th February 2011 at 07:37 #

    STEW

    The dealers get their money from Dubai and Jordon not the CBI and Dubai and Jordon get their Dinars from TBI , TBI bought their Dinar from the CBI and can not buy anymore

  13. Stew 4th February 2011 at 08:20 #

    James... the dealers have been pushing the line that they are running out of dinar for 4 or 5 yeras now. It's a PUMP! Simple as that.
    The CBI runs an open auction every day where they meet the demand of the banks participating. If one of those banks wanted to buy 1 Trillion dinar, the CBI would sell 1 Trillion dinar to them.

    Notice how they put this in the auction article every day.
    "None of the 18 banks that participated in today’s session offered to sell dollars."

    If a bank offered to sell dollars, same as buy dinar, the CBI would sell dinars.

  14. yippee101 4th February 2011 at 18:32 #

    Shares in Gulf Keystone (LSE: GKP)jumped 5.5% in London on Wednesday after the company announced the completion of drilling and testing operations on its Shaikan-3 shallow appraisal well. This well was designed to drill and test the Cretaceous intervals in the immediate vicinity of the Shaikan-1 discovery well. The Company has a 75 percent working interest in the Block and is partnered with the MOL subsidiary, Kalegran, and Texas Keystone which have the remaining 20 and 5 percent working interests respectively.
    The well drilled the entire Cretaceous interval and on into the Jurassic Sargelu formation. A total of two open hole and two cased hole flow tests were conducted in the Cretaceous. As a result of these tests, log evaluations and recovered fluid samples, the Company’s current P50 to P10 estimate of Garagu oil in place volumes is 220 million to 2.2 billion barrels. These Garagu resources are in the lower portion of the Cretaceous (between 1060m and 1157m). The Shaikan partner group will formulate a development plan for these resources.
    The large spread between P50 and P10 volumes is due to the uncertainty with respect to the exact nature of the Cretaceous down dip, on the flanks of the Shaikan structure. If the Cretaceous is oil bearing near the flanks, then the P10 volumes become more likely and it is possible that the oil will also be less viscous and of higher API gravity.
    In the mean time, due to the different characteristics of the Cretaceous oil, the Shaikan-3 well has been completed as a second Jurassic producer from the Sargelu formation and will flow into the same test facilities as the Shaikan-1 well.
    John Gerstenlauer, Gulf Keystone’s Chief Operating Officer commented:
    “The Cretaceous resources evaluated by the Shaikan-3 well are massive by any standard. They represent a significant oil resource for Kurdistan and Iraq. It is a further demonstration of the huge hydrocarbon potential of the area.“

    https://www.iraq-businessnews.com/2011/01/05/gulf-keystone-jumps-on-shaikan-3-news/

  15. yippee101 4th February 2011 at 18:48 #

    With more companies moving in on the oil and the seats almost all filled the stability grows and so will the dinar...whether an overnight RV(which we all hope for) or a slower growth with economy the dinar WILL grow and is a sound investment for those that invest wisely and only with money they are prepared to wait some time for a ROI with. I don't know a lot of people that have poured mortgage money into this and I hope there aren't any as NO investment is without risk. I simply saved the money that I would have poured down my throat every morning at Starbucks for a couple of months, I lost 15 pounds and gained a paltry 250000 dinar. If it revalues tomorrow I did good....if I keep saving and have the opportunity to do another 250000 dinar at the end of this month then I will happily do so knowing that at some time in the next few months to next few years Iraq is going to make something of themselves again.

  16. Rabibi 4th February 2011 at 20:45 #

    @Yipee,

    Very well said! I feel like I should buy you a cup of coffee. The Turks, Arabs and Ethiopians have some of the best coffee. The Bedouins still grind their beans with stone. If you ever get a chance to go to the middle east you should try some.

  17. yippee101 4th February 2011 at 23:44 #

    lol...thanks Rabibi. You're on for the coffee and we can all celebrate at some fantastic place in time...sooner rather than later I hope. Now if everyone just enjoyed the ride and understood that they are witnessing the rebirth of a country in chaos they wouldn't be in such an all fired hurry and can just relax...it's a comin'.

  18. yippee101 5th February 2011 at 18:23 #

    Recognizing the importance of Iraq achieving international standing equal to that which it held prior to the adoption of resolution 661,

    Hmmmmmm:)

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2010/12/15/fact-sheet-un-security-council-high-level-meeting-iraq

  19. Brit 5th February 2011 at 22:27 #

    yippee101 - Hmmmmmmm??? If everything were equal to 1990, that would mean that Iraq would lop. They did not have near the amount of dinar in their monetary system then as they have now.

    I would love to see Iraq perform the action that some claim is an inevitability. However, it simply makes no sense. 000 currency values have been dealt with many times now, all doing it the same way, redenomination a.k.a. LOP.

    Iraq's economy is, has been, and will continue to be based on oil sales. The lifetime value of their oil supply would negate any significant rise in value to the dinar with the current levels of currency that they have.

  20. Stew 6th February 2011 at 11:53 #

    Exactly Brit.
    One of the most ridiculous statements we keep hearing over and over is “no one knows what’s going to happen”.
    Well… yes, no one knows the exact outcome, but one thing that we know for sure, without any doubt what so ever, done deal, it’s over, forget about it… is the big RV. There is no way in hell they RV that much currency to anything substantial. Even if they only had an M2 of 1 trillion they couldn’t RV to $1. They have an M2 of 58 Trillion. It’s ridiculous to think they would RV that.

  21. Stew 6th February 2011 at 12:03 #

    1991
    http://www.cbi.iq/documents/Annual_2002f.pdf
    Look at table 2.
    In 1991 Iraq has 21.8 Billion currency in circulation, and M1 of 24.6 Billion

    Now
    http://www.cbi.iq/documents/key%20financial.xls
    They have 27 Trillion currency in circulation, and an M1 of 49.7 Trillion

    Done deal, lop 3 zeros makes PERFECT sense.

  22. gr 6th February 2011 at 13:08 #

    Glad Iraq finally approved their budget and made better provisions for their citizens. Also the World Bank posted a great article on transitioning from a centralized economy to a market economy.
    http://www.mot.gov.iq/office_2.htm
    Use google translate for above link. The Iraqi Govt is pushing for acceptance into WTO and also a centralized economy as well.
    Best of luck to Iraq and her citizens.

  23. Stew 6th February 2011 at 16:23 #

    So the RV wasn't written into the budget like all the pumpers claimed?
    So they are wrong again... what a surprise.
    WTO RV will be the next thing they are wrong about.

  24. Stew 6th February 2011 at 18:44 #

    1991
    http://www.cbi.iq/documents/Annual_2002f.pdf
    Look at table 2.
    In 1991 Iraq has 21.8 Billion currency in circulation, and M1 of 24.6 Billion

  25. Stew 6th February 2011 at 18:45 #

    Now
    http://www.cbi.iq/documents/key%20financial.xls
    They have 27 Trillion currency in circulation, and an M1 of 49.7 Trillion

    Done deal, lop 3 zeros makes PERFECT sense.

  26. Government Connected 8th February 2011 at 09:13 #

    I've been following this blog since day 1, and have been amused by Stew's constant point about there being no re-valuation of the IQD, and also the battles he's had with several members. Well, I am here to bring this news link, released today by the IKH news.

    http://www.ikhnews.c..._view_8170.html

    Shabibi: the independence of the Central Bank of the umbrella of a protector of state funds
    بواسطة: mano By: mano
    بتاريخ : الثلاثاء 08-02-2011 01:23 مساء On: Tuesday 08/02/2011 13:23

    بغداد(الاخبارية)..دعا محافظ البنك المركزي سنان الشبيبي الى استقلالية البنك لانه مظلة حامية لاموال الدولة.وقال الشبيبي خلال عقدت ندوة اقامتها مؤسسة (المدى) لمناقشة قضية استقلال البنك المركزي وحضرته مراسلة (الوكالة الاخبارية للانباء): ان"منح الاستقلالية للبنك المركزي له اهمية كبيرة لانه مظلة حامية لاموال الدولة"، Baghdad (news) .. called Central Bank Governor Sinan al-Shabibi to the independence of the Bank that the umbrella of a protector of state funds. Shabibi said during a symposium hosted by the Foundation (range) to discuss the issue of independence of the Central Bank and attended by a reporter Agency (news): "The granting of independence to the Central Bank is of great significance because it is the umbrella of a protector of state funds, "
    مستدركا:"لكن على الحكومة ان لاتفهم ان البنك منعزلا عنها بل اننا نعمل مع السوق والحكومة بشكل كبير." Afterthought: "But the government might not understand that the bank isolated it, but we are working with the market and the government significantly."
    واضاف الشبيبي : لايمكن الفصل بين الحكومة والبنك المركزي لان اهمية السياسة النقدية تعتمد وفق القانون على التعاون مع الحكومة.واشار الى ان اساس اقتصاد البنك هو محاربة التضخم الذي يحصل بسبب الحكومة او القطاع الخاص، ويعمل على تطبيق السياسة النقدية سواء في اسعار الفائدة لتحقيق استقرار النمو ومساندة المصارف في الازمات من خلال التنسيق المباشر. He Shabibi: can not separation between the government and the central bank because the importance of monetary policy depends according to the law on cooperation with the government. He pointed out that the basis of the economy the Bank is to fight inflation, which happen because the government or the private sector, and works on the application of monetary policy both in the interest rates to stabilize the growth and support for banks in crisis through direct coordination.
    وبين الشبيبي:ان البنك المركزي يقوم بمتابعة تخصيصات الموازنة الحكومية من اجل ضبط الصرف وتقليل معالجة عدم التوازن ../انتهى/(3.ر.م) And Shabibi: that the central bank will follow the government's budget allocations in order to adjust the exchange rate and reduce address the imbalance .. / Finished / (3. T. M

    Dr. Shabibi, whom I have personally met on numerous occasions, is steadfast in his desire to return his beloved country of Iraq to prominence. Up until Saddam's decision to invade Kuwait, Iraq was the regional power that kept a control and balance in the region, specifically over Iran. This link and press release should put to rest the arguments about the RV. As I work for the IMF in New York, I can verify the authenticity of this news document, and can further validate the plan for the Iraqi government to increase the value of the IQD without any sort of LOP. Despite what Stew has been claiming, the currency value of the IQD was artificially deflated by the IMF, in conjunction with the UN. The stated goal is to return the IQD to a value of at minimum, on par with the dollar. I do not personally know the rate that the IQD will be increased to, but in speaking with several colleagues who are involved in this matter, it's becoming clearer, that the value will be fixed for a short duration, 90-180 days, and then will be allowed to float in the open market.

    For obvious reasons, I can not reveal who I am. Just leaking this info could cause a reprimand. However, once the re-valuation has occured, I'll be happy to come back and reveal myself.

    My credentials, in case anyone is wondering? PHD from Yale, Former director of foreign currency for a major New York bank. Currently serving on the IMF board for currency policy and implementation. I'm sure I'm going to get some grief from Stew, but I am steadfast in my knowledge of the events that have caused the current financial crisis in Iraq, and the steps being currently taken to adjust the imbalance. I can tell you this much. I HIGHLY doubt that the rate is anywhere near what many have been posting. Again, I see a return to pre war levels, based upon my many conversations with others who are directly involved. This is not rumor, but is fact.

  27. Stew 9th February 2011 at 11:38 #

    You should be put in jail.

  28. Government Connected 9th February 2011 at 11:50 #

    On what grounds, law genious? For telling the truth, even though it doesn't fit your little world? Get over yourself. In the big scheme of things, you really are a nobody. You don't have the authority to do a damn thing.

  29. Stew 9th February 2011 at 12:17 #

    LOL... thanks for pointing that out Mark.

    Priceless

  30. Rabibi 9th February 2011 at 12:28 #

    Not saying this guy is or is not legit but they do have a NY office

    Fund Office United Nations
    885 Second Ave, 26th Floor
    New York, NY 10017
    Tel: + 1 (212) 893-1700
    Fax: + 1 (212) 893-1715

    Scroll down on the contact page

    http://www.imf.org/external/np/exr/contacts/contacts.aspx

  31. yippee101 9th February 2011 at 13:59 #

    I am sooooo going to love saying I told you so...thanks Gov!

  32. Brit 9th February 2011 at 15:14 #

    I would really like to believe something like this, however, how can one take something seriously when they claim that they will get in trouble if they release their identity, yet immediately state their credentials which would definately narrow the field of who to be looking at for 'leaking such information'.

  33. LZ 9th February 2011 at 15:35 #

    Govement Connected is JC

  34. James 9th February 2011 at 15:55 #

    LZ You know that for a FACT ?

  35. Stew 9th February 2011 at 16:05 #

    I suspect you are right JC. He said 5 times he was done with this board, so I guess he had to make up another persona to post as.
    Gotta admit… he’s got imagination. First he was a multi millionaire, 4 corporations, 3 business and economic degrees, multi million dollar real estate trust, , multi million trust funds for all his kids, contact in the CBI and multiple friends who are Bank managers.
    LOL…
    Now he works for the IMF and claims to have met Dr Shabibi a number of times. Has a PHD from Yale, Former director of foreign currency at a “major” NY bank, and serves on the IMF board for currency policy and implementation.

    LOL… Yep LZ… I’d say it’s the same guy.
    What a hoot.

  36. Rabibi 9th February 2011 at 16:51 #

    Well there seems to be three people at the IMF with Phds from Yale
    Who knows whether the gentlemen that posted is one of them. If he is one of them then we should thank him for his time and effort to post on this forum and respect his decision to remain anonymous.

    http://www.imf.org/external/np/cv/AuthorCV.aspx?AuthID=118

    http://www.imf.org/external/np/cv/AuthorCV.aspx?AuthID=134

    http://www.imf.org/external/np/cv/AuthorCV.aspx?AuthID=131

    I guess the IMF likes guys from Yale.

  37. Government Connected 9th February 2011 at 22:59 #

    Just what I expected. Attack the poster when you can't attack the post.

    Thank you Rabibi for pointing out where I do work, though my work does take me to DC at minimum of 2 times a month. As for my credentials, and it making me easy to find out. You can't turn the corner at the IMF without running into a member with a PhD, and I am far from the only former foreign currency banker on staff.

    What strikes me the most about Stew, is his constant attacks against those who bring facts, supported by documentation. He never addresses the facts, and I suspect that is because he is indeed, still invested in the IQD.

    Stew, I have a bit of news you will probably not find to your liking, but frankly, could care less. When the new IQD was ordered and printed, there was not 27 trillion IQD printed. There is a substantial amount that is in digital banking. The total order for physical currency was 400 billion dinar.

    So, there you have it. Attack away Stew, as it is really all you are good at. My skin is thick, and I've been attacked by far smarter than you.

  38. Stew 10th February 2011 at 09:43 #

    Central Bank updates money supply numbers.
    http://www.cbi.iq/documents/key%20financial.xls
    M2 crosses 60 Trillion mark.

    Physical currency in circulation is line 76 plus line 80.
    That’s 24.3 plus 3.2 for 27.5 Trillion physical dinar in circulation.

    Add electronic money to the 27.5 Trillion physical currency for
    51.7 Trillion M1 and
    60.3 Trillion M2

    JC/government connected.
    What names do pump dinar under on the big dinar sites?

  39. Government Connected 10th February 2011 at 10:28 #

    What you are not taking into account, and that I know is fact, is the IQD that the CBI is holding in vault, large through small notes, is counted as in circulation, even if it's been collected by the CBI for destruction. Until they are given the order to do so, they must continue to hold onto that money. If Bank of Baghdad orders 10 million dinar, they don't literally transport 10 million dinar to that bank. It is electronically transfered onto their books. This allows for easy transfer and payment for debts. I am looking for the news article where the actual order was placed and shipped.

    Pumper? Have I made one suggestion to anyone to go and buy any dinar? Have I represented any dinar sites? There is comfort for you Stew, to make your accusations behind the safety of your computer screen. Stay there, as it's the only place in the real world where you are safe.

  40. mark 10th February 2011 at 11:16 #

    Govt. Connected, I'd like to think what you're saying is legit but there has been so much false info put out there by pumpers that it's hard to separate fact from fiction. Hopefully we'll see some increase in value over time but don't see anything happening now to show that anything's going to happen in the near future. I'd love to see a huge jump in value but what do they have to gain by doing that?

  41. Stew 10th February 2011 at 11:22 #

    I have shown you JC/Gov Connect a number of times the document from the central bank of Iraq that proves you are lying. Yet you continue to spew the falsehood over and over. That is a perfect pumper… ignore the facts and continue to push the lies. You have blatantly lied about who you are and you continue to blatantly lie about things dinar related.

    Once again… the CBI says JC is a lier.
    http://www.cbi.iq/documents/Key_Financial_Indicators_Documentation.pdf

    Clearly states… Currency outside of banks is only currency put into circulation less what they have redeemed.
    So currency never put into circulation is not part of the figure, and it clearly states that dinar redeemed, bought back, is also accounted for in reporting the number.

  42. Government Connected 10th February 2011 at 11:29 #

    You sure are a brave soul behind a computer screen Stew. You do not know half of what you are talking about. Numbers can easily be manipulated. I know for a fact that government agencies do it all the time. Do you honestly think our own government hasn't forged the books? Hell, I'd bet money you don't pay all of your taxes. There you have it people, Stew is a tax cheat! It has as much validity as you linking me to Jc.

  43. gr 10th February 2011 at 11:38 #

    I'm just trying to figure out why everyone who 'believes in' or 'supports' buying IQD is a pumper? I have not seen anyone namedrop in here. And if someone were pumping, they would drop the name of their dealer or website. There are at least 10 online dealers I know, so in order to make a profit, they would have to drop a name.

    So, let me get this straight. Believers in IQD = Pumpers. So, that means: Non-believer in IQD = Dumpers.

    Fair is fair. We now have the battle of the Pumpers vs the Dumpers! I guess the way it looks we're in the playoffs here. Cheer for your fav team, folks, the Pumpers or the Dumpers? ROFLMBO. I crack me up!

  44. Government Connected 10th February 2011 at 11:46 #

    Mark,
    I see a gradual increase of the IQD, not a huge jump like some have promoted. There is a lot of talk within the IMF about the IQD going through an RI at the old rate, but for now, it's just talk. I know we are in trouble financially, with the demands from Europe, China's unwillingness to increase their value of the Yuan, which currently sits at around 6.599 to the dollar. When Hu Jintao visited back in January, President Obama tried to pursuade President Jintao to increase the value of the yuan, and to decrease the trade embalance that is currenty sitting at around $250 billion. His results were prro at best.

    Why would Iraq increase the value of the dinar? An open market trade agreement with the current value of the IQD would cause great instability in the region. It would favor Iraq's citizens to have more buying power, and in fact, that plan is already in place to happen. Recently, it was learned that Prime Minister Maliki proppsed to give every Iraqi citizen 15,000 dinar per year, distributed monthly. Now, at the current rate, that equals about $17 for the year. So, the only thing that makes sense is to have an increase of value. Even at a dollar for dinar scenario, that greatly increases the wealth of the typical Iraqi citizen. $15,000 per year, divided over 12 months is a substantial wellfare amount for each citizen, and falls in line with other counbtries in the region ike Saudi Arabia and Kuwait. Currently, all contracts are paid by the dollar, but they want out of that agreement. Eventually, the entire region will change to a different currency base, and when that happens, I suspect that the dollar will be debased from a majority of the international trade dealings.

  45. gr 10th February 2011 at 11:55 #

    Actually, it's $15,000 dinar per month that Maliki stated. And the Kuwaitis get way more than $15,000 per year. Their dollar is 3.55 to our 1. They get about 70K a year for adults and then more for each child. They just received a 'bonus' of 1,000 KWD for every citizen -- man, woman and child -- in celebration of their 50/20 anniversary which starts here next week. That $3,555 each citizen. They do NOT work period. And they live lavishly compared to the average American citizen. They almost all have servants, maids and nannies, who of course are NOT Kuwaiti, but foreign nationals who get treated like indentured slaves!

  46. Government Connected 10th February 2011 at 14:42 #

    I stand corrected about the amount of dinar printed, 2 billion, and not 400 million, but it's still FAR short of the 27 trillion Stew claims.

    http://www.starnewsonline.com/article/20070801/NEWS/708010478

    Straight from the horses mouth, as they say. Like I said, a HUGE chunk is in digital currency. Stew, is it possible you just don't have all of the facts? Is it possible the CBI is posting things that even you can't grasp? I'm betting on it.

    How does our own country get into debt by 14 trillion, when our own money supply doesn't amount to that much? Digital banking is the answer.

  47. Government Connected 10th February 2011 at 14:47 #

    GR,
    I did see a news article about Iraq making it 15,000 dinars per year, but I also saw the newer article about the 15,000 dinar per month. My guess is, that once the new value is established, that figure will be revised. At the current rate, it's still very little money to live on, about $12 per month.

    It's a shame that they are dragging their feet on getting the government seated. The people are suffering.

  48. Stew 10th February 2011 at 15:24 #

    Good grief IMF genius. Let me explain it to you.

    From the original exchange… http://www.defense.gov/transcripts/transcript.aspx?transcriptid=3030
    Q Tony, on the exchange rate, the old dinar was worth -- a 10,000 dollar (sic) note was worth about five bucks. What's the new one worth, just to --

    MR. FRATTO: The same

    So the original exchange rate was about 2000 to 1. So your article which states “more than $2 billion in new dinars”.
    That’s more than 4 Trillion dinars.

    And that was just the original exchange

  49. Stew 10th February 2011 at 15:28 #

    And that matches perfectly with this article from Feb 2004.
    http://www.newsweek.com/2004/02/01/money-bet-your-bottom-dinar.html
    By Jan. 15, when the three-month changeover ended, 4.5 trillion new dinars had been issued.
    And
    According to Ahmed Muhammad, a deputy governor of Iraq's central bank, roughly half the 4.5 trillion new dinars have been removed from domestic circulation, either stashed away at home or smuggled out for sale abroad. Iraqi officials say it's illegal to export the dinar